Institute Childrens Literature

Rx for Writers

Transcripts

PART 2 of Kenny Mann's interview follows:

Kevin: How do you organize your life to have time to write? Do you have a day job?

Kenny:Oh wow...I have several jobs. I've developed a nice rhythm out here, but I'm dying to change it. I work three days a week in a great antique store which pays me very well. I teach from September to June at Friends World College, two hard evenings a week (6 hours each time). I teach and edit for the Institute of Children's Literature, and then I take on many freelance projects as they come. It's hard to make time, but I only sleep about 5-6 hours a night, and do most of my writing at night.

MODERATOR: Is this kind of schedule necessary to make it as a writer, do you think?

Kenny:Perhaps not if you are already successful or have someone supporting you financially. I am "successful" in that my work always gets published, but it is not exactly rewarding financially, so I don't have any choice. And yes, to write the bestseller takes unbelievable hours of work.

Ladybug: How realistic is it to make writing your primary source of income, including writing for magazines etc.?

Kenny:I don't want to discourage anyone, but I would suggest that you get a few publications under your belt before giving up your job. Unless, as I said, you have some financial support. Otherwise, go for it with all the energy you can muster. Learn to be very targeted in your work. Avoid useless phone calls and letters. Do your marketing research thoroughly.

MODERATOR: Excellent advice! How can you find the right job to support your literary career while you're getting your writing feet on the ground? Are some jobs better than others for this?

Kenny:I've done many things., including cleaning houses. I generally prefer jobs that are not connected with writing, so that my mind is not cluttered up with other people's projects, hence the job in the antique store which I don't have to think about. However, I do find that all my work is related in one way or another. For example, the antique store is like a soap opera. I have all kinds of scenarios that were written based on events there, and I often test my work with my employers who are great listeners. So it's up to the individual. I also spend hours in front of my computer, so I don't want to spend hours in front of someone else's computer. In other words, I try to keep my creative energy for my own work and do "silly" work for others.

MODERATOR: This fascinates me . . . How do you know if you have what it takes to be a professional writer?

Kenny:You just keep trying! You'll know when editors show an interest in your ideas. You will also know internally. You either want to do it and are geared up by the idea of having your name in print (a great motivator) or you're not. Or you feel you have important things to say and want to get them out there, no matter what. But to be professional means to keep writing and KEEP PUBLISHING. The closet writer is not a professional.

Ladybug: How does one go about doing really effective market research? Is there any particular place to go or look?

Kenny:Not really. It depends on the project. You need to check whether similar work has been done before. The usual library sources will help. The books in print is a good source. Most of all, a real knowledge of your readership...if you're planning a book for 7-10-year-olds, make sure you know that market thoroughly. Check to see what else is out there.

Sasquatch: If you think you've done everything right--checked and double checked all key areas of a manuscript, then send it and get a 'form' rejection, is there ever any way to find out why it was rejected?

Kenny:You can sometimes call the editor and find out, if it is a small publisher. It's one way of establishing a relationship with an editor. Often, they might give you tips on how to improve the material. But you don't want to harass or bug an editor too much, or you'll end up on the blacklist. Also, editors may not be reading the work themselves. They will often have first and second readers who look at submitted material first. If they reject it, the editor never gets to see it.

Verbivore: Do you attend writer's retreats and conferences or belong to a writer's group?

Kenny:I used to belong to the Bank Street writers' group - one of the oldest and best in the country. I've attended some local workshops - I live in an area that is home to many really famous writers. But I generally prefer to work on my own now and have a pretty good idea of what's good and what isn't.

MODERATOR: When a story is rejected or critiqued by your writer's group, how do you decide whether to revise or stick by your manuscript?

Kenny:I always listen to what other writers say and then I form my own opinion. Again, I generally prefer to work with one editor because everyone will have a different opinion and no one of them is the only possibility.

MODERATOR: Do you keep educating yourself with classes and writing books?

Kenny: I no longer attend classes, although I might this summer. There's a good summer class at the local college held by some really good nonfiction writers. But at this stage, I'm on my own. I keep reading materials about writing, and I'm always learning, but I learn as much about writing from films and music and theatre and art as I do from writing.

MODERATOR: Can you explain that last statement? How is that possible?

Kenny:Because these art forms speak of the times and they use visual symbols, or musical symbols to say what I say in words. They also have structure--a film, a painting, a sonata--all have structure, and that's what nonfiction is all about.

MODERATOR: I can see that I'm quite limited in how I view writing!

Kenny:Most people are, especially today, when people have so many different media at their fingertips. Writers need to be aware of how this effects people's minds. Children today are far more visually oriented than ever before, and books need to be structured for digital media as well as for traditional reading.

MODERATOR: Can you explain "structured for digital media?"

Kenny:My African books were written as text, of course, but in my mind, I also visualized them for CD-ROM and video, which meant that I knew where a reader might click to learn more about something not outlined in the text of the book. Traditional writing is structured horizontally, from left to right in our culture. Now we need to think of writing - especially nonfiction - as a weave of thoughts - horizontal and vertical, which is how digital media are constructed.

Kevin: So do you use a lot of sidebars in your nonfiction? What goes in a good sidebar?

Kenny:Yes, I do... a good sidebar, like a good caption, should enhance the text or give new information not included in the text. It should be catchy, a "nugget" that will fascinate readers and that they won't find anywhere else.

Sasquatch: Wouldn't a sidebar be like the click-on button to learn more?

Kenny:Yes - the sidebar is like a click button - good point - so are captions, visual images and words.

kmadsen: Are there subjects that a beginning writer should avoid?

Kenny:Not that I know of. Well maybe those that have already been done to death because, of course, you will want to find a new angle.

Kevin: How do you get warmed up and in the mood to write when you're tired or discouraged or sick?

Kenny:It's hard - but that's part of being professional. You just have to do it. But I ALSO procrastinate a lot.

MODERATOR: Tell us how you overcome that!

Kenny:I have learned to recognize how my energy flows. I am not a morning person, so my energy is low before 11 a.m. so I take my time with my shower, etc. But once I'm on, I'm on, and I keep going for a long time. It's really important to recognize those energy flow patterns and each person is different, so you shouldn't fight ennui too much, as long as you know that at some point in the day you will get started.

MODERATOR: Amen! You touched on this earlier, but when doing research, how do you really decide when enough is enough and it's time to write?

Kenny:It's a feeling - one needs to have read a great deal around the subject to know its limits, and one needs to know which research sources are good and which aren't. I can only say there's no formula...it really is a feeling that comes with practice.

Kevin: You hear such conflicting advice about how to approach editors. Some people say never call; some say call. I'm afraid of turning an editor off or getting blacklisted, like you mentioned earlier.

Kenny:First be sure of your topic. I always call an editor before sending in a proposal or a query. They will either tell you they want to hear the idea over the phone, or they will ask you to send in the outline. Either way, you've got an "in" and if you send in an outline, you should remind the editor that you spoke to her on such and such a date.

MODERATOR: After your books are published, what kind of promoting, if any, do you do? How much of your writing time do you devote to this?

Kenny:Unfortunately, most publishers do not do enough PR in my opinion. I do as much as I can at school book fairs, educational conferences, etc. and over the Internet, but it si a very time-consuming and rather frustrating job.

Kevin: What do you do over the Internet? Do you have a web site?

Kenny:I do, but it is a little outdated right now. My publisher for the African series was just bought out and the books are about to be purchased by another publisher, so things are confused.

Sasquatch: Can we have the web site anyway?

Kenny:You can look for me under Rafiki Books or Hampton Arts.

MODERATOR: I don't understand--do we look that up in a search engine?

Kenny:I don't have the exact web address because I am linked to someone else. Yes, look it up in a search engine, it's easy to find.

MODERATOR: Also, Kenny, do you have things we HAVEN'T asked that would be helpful to know?

Kenny: I do have one comment - it's really important for new writers to keep up with technological advances today. It's no longer enough to sit at your typewriter or computer and call yourself a writer, especially in the field of children's literature. I think that one can considerably expand one's market and earning power by writing for various media, and one can learn to use the research that one has done for one project to develop another and sell it, as long as there is no conflict of interest.

MODERATOR: Do you find that writers DO tend to sit in front of their computers and not learn what they need to know? You've taught a lot of writers!

Kenny:A lot of people still believe that it is easy to write, but as soon as they get a taste of the discipline and the isolation, they give up! Many writers have a romantic or nostalgic attitude about writing and don't want to learn new techniques or technologies. Of course, there are writers who are extremely successful doing what they have always done. There are even those who still use pencil and paper because, after all, the quality of the writing does not depend on the medium. But in regards to younger audiences, who are very much in tune with technology, we need to develop material, that is, stories and materials that are also tied in with those technologies.

MODERATOR: Do you journal by hand? Does doing it by hand affect the quality of your writing? Some writers believe it does.

Kenny:I do not journal at all, except to note events between myself and my daughter, but many people do enjoy doing that by hand. My handwriting is so poor that I do it as little as possible.

Sasquatch: What other technological advances is it imperative to know? And how would one go about submitting to any other type? Are you talking about learning programs on video, or what, exactly? I lost you there.

Kenny:One should be able to write for regular print, for video, for CD-ROM; those are the three major media right now. Any book that is published for younger readers, or many books (especially nonfiction) are produced in those three media and publishers need to work with authors who know how to adapt their work accordingly. An example: I wrote a story about an African king for one of the books. Another publisher wanted to use the story on a laser disc for kids. I had to adapt the story myself. I was lucky because I have a background in film, so this was not hard, but I needed to know how to set out the story board, how to time the narrative properly, and how to capture the story which took 20 minutes to read aloud in a 6 mm clip.

Kevin: If I wanted to learn to write for CD-ROM, how would I learn?

Kenny:I don't know how you would learn, Kevin, since I haven't learned it myself! I am sure that there are classes and places where you could go. I am a self-learner, so I would study CD-ROM's in the field of interest and see how they have been put together and how writing works with animation, etc.

Sasquatch: Where does one learn those skills--video, etc.? Do you need to do the video yourself as well? Or do you write something, and they back it up with video like an illustrator would?

bbc: And where would you go to look? For the classes?

Kenny:I'd look in computer schools, any place that has adult ed or computer classes, community colleges, any college that has courses in media studies, local ads in your papers.

MODERATOR: Kenny, many people seem to be asking the same question: HOW DO I LEARN THIS?

Kenny: Basically, you need to study the medium, just as you study books in your field.

MODERATOR: You mentioned a film background before. Has this been very instrumental in your success in various media?

Kenny:I love film even more than writing! It has helped me to structure my work, to visualize it in this age of illustration and to edit, because of course, film is the editor's medium. I recently took a course in writing screenplays, and was fascinated to see how much I learned about writing in general.

MODERATOR: I'm sorry, but I'm afraid we have to stop for this evening. We want to thank Kenny for sharing her expertise on nonfiction with us tonight. If you want to download this excellent information, you will find a complete copy of tonight's interview tomorrow in the "Transcripts" section of the Chat Room page. Thank you for coming tonight, Kenny!

Kenny:Thanks, all of you. I really enjoyed your questions - and good luck.

MODERATOR: COME BACK NEXT THURSDAY EVENING to hear Vicki Berger Erwin speak about series writing. She is the author of a six-book mystery series, and has written for the Baby-sitters Club and other series. Come and ask Vicki everything you want to know about writing series. Until then, have a great week!

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