Instititute of Children's Literature

Rx for Writers

Transcripts

"Getting on Track and Staying There: Time Management for Writers Who Also Have a Life" with Joan Broerman

Thursday, July 19, 2001

Moderator is Kristi Holl, web editor for this site and author of 24 books and 150+ articles. She also taught writing for children for 15 years.

Joan is Joan Broerman has seven children and writes for both children and adults (with recent sales to POCKETS and THE CHILDREN'S WRITER.) Her adult book, WEEKEND GETAWAYS IN ALABAMA, is published by Pelican. Joan is also very active in SCBWI and has been "Member of the Year" in the recent past.

Names color coded in blue are viewers who had questions.

Interviews are held on Thursday nights for two hours beginning [9 CANADA/Atlantic], 8 Eastern, 7 Central, 6 Mountain, and 5 Pacific.

Moderator: Good evening, everyone! I'm glad you all could be here tonight. I'm Kristi Holl, your moderator and the web editor for this site. We're here tonight with Joan Broerman who will be talking on the subject of "Getting on Track and Staying There: Time Management for Writers Who Also Have a Life." This is certainly a subject that pertains to all of us, no matter where we are in our writing careers! Welcome, Joan!

Joan: Thanks, Kristi. I've been looking forward to being here ever since you invited me. This is always a fun time.

Moderator: First, Joan, what made you decide to try writing? Had you always wanted to be a writer? How did you get started?

Joan: I guess my first grade teacher gets the credit. She really saved me. I hate to admit it, but I didn't like school. It was such a shock to discover that my first grade teacher wasn't as impressed with me as my parents were. One miserable hot fall day, we were all crammed onto the school bus, finally heading home when a "big" kid tapped me on the shoulder. She asked if I wrote the poem in the school paper. I had no idea what she was talking about. The other "big kid" sitting beside her read a poem aloud. It WAS my poem. I said it was and the reader announced, "I liked it." I had not known the teacher had submitted my poem--didn't even know there was a school paper. But the rush I got when that big 8th grader said she LIKED what I wrote hooked me for life. I've been trying to get that rush back ever since.

Moderator: Neat story. What is a typical writing day like for you?

Joan: I'm a morning person, so I'm up early watching the day grow light. I feel like I'm getting off to a good start, and I like to start with something that really is close to my heart. Usually it's fiction, but sometimes I'm so enthusiastic about a proposal, that that is what flows across the page--or the computer. I've really come to depend on the computer and I never thought I would. If I hadn't married a computer guru, I'd probably still write with a quill pen. Later in the day, I have little blocks of time when I work on contracted work, phone calls, interviews, committee work, that kind of writer related thing.

Moderator: Do you really have SEVEN children and still write?

Joan: Yes. Seven grandchildren, too.

Moderator: How do you get your family to take you seriously?

Joan: All of them, the children growing up and now the grandchildren, too, like to be involved, engaged, part of something. They've been part of the writing. Some have written their own newspapers, such as neighborhood gazettes. Others have illustrated what I've written, while I worked. They love to go to storytelling sessions at the library, places where children's books are sold. One young grandson has been super about looking for my book, WEEKEND GETAWAYS IN ALABAMA and announcing to the world at large that his grandmother wrote that book, and then he reads the dedication to "children and grandchildren" and says he's one of the grandchildren. I call him my PR man.

Moderator: Can you give us some specific ways to accomplish this, getting a family to take your writing seriously?

Joan: In trying to get anyone to take a writer's work seriously, the writer must first take herself (or himself) seriously. If you truly believe in yourself, you can set those boundaries for your writing. I think you said it very well in one of your RX pieces, Kristi: don't set a boundary unless you are prepared to enforce it.

Moderator: How do you get your friends to take you seriously?

Joan: With either friends or family, reassure them that you are there for them when they really need you. Say it's a call that interrupts from a friend or an adult child--say you'll call back that afternoon, and DO it, then they can see you are making them a priority too. Sometimes with younger children it takes being creative, such as sitting a toddler down near you and asking her to color the pictures of your story or write her own. I love it when a young reader "reads" her story to me and she must read it to me, because the language is her very own.

Moderator: In your experience, how do friends respond to you "claiming your time"? I've had some real mixed reactions!

Joan: When you first do this, I think you have to be prepared to lose a friend or two. Some people really can't get it that you are working when you are home in front of a computer screen or sitting on your deck with a book. Reading looks so casual, and yet it is most important for writers to read. You have to ask yourself, if you do lose a friend, whether that friend was really a true friend if she can't support your quest for that dream. It may be that the friendship was more about her than the two of you. As for my friends, I've been incredibly lucky. A few have drifted away over the years, but their Christmas cards have been enthusiastic about my work, now that they can pick up a magazine or book and see my name.

Moderator: Joan, what's really underneath this problem, do you think? Is it jealousy or what?

Joan: Yes, I think it's a matter of being left behind while you move to something outside the relationship. I've seen the same thing happen when one friend loses about 50 pounds and the one who didn't gets really hostile about it. It's a matter of change, and many people are threatened by that.

Oma: A published writer friend recently told me not to worry about getting published, just write for the love of it. Consider the apple tree: it doesn't care if its fruit is eaten or not. What do you think?

Joan: I think the love of writing has to under gird the pursuit of it. If you are under pressure to produce and you really hate what you are writing about, it's going to show somewhere. Love the writer and love the work. These work best. Of course, this takes some revising of your life, just as you have to revise your writing.

Elsie Rae: How did you convince your significant other to let you have time to write with children to care for?

Joan: Actually, I've been in a situation where I was politely requested not to write. Being a docile housewife at the time, I became a quiet writer and stopped publishing. The marriage died. I almost did, too. Happily, I married a man who saw right away that I needed to write, and he has done all kinds of supportive things to help, from building me my own writing studio to screening calls while I work to driving kids. I won't bubble over all over the screen, but I do know the difference in having a supportive spouse and not having one.

For those who do not, I suggest this, and I hope it helps. Get support somewhere else, from a supportive critique group, from another writer who can listen to your work and give you constructive feedback. You may find others who find your support is valuable to them. I have also been in critique groups that were not supportive and am now in one that is absolutely fantastic. So I know the difference there, too. If a writer has to step back and see whether a relationship is helping or hurting the writing, that writer may need to ask if that relationship is helpful to the person as a person, too.

menucha: I am extremely one track minded. I am a kindergarten teacher and I love teaching. I also love writing. The problem is that when I get involved in one thing the other suffers. I can't seem to focus on both. Any suggestions?

Joan: Can you block a time and place for one and only one, a dedicated space, for example that is just for your teaching thoughts and materials and planning? The writing space is special to you. The only thing you do in your writing space is what pertains to that. The minute you sit down in your writing space, you will know that everything else is put away from you. I've had to do that when I had 6 kids in seven schools and the carpooling alone was a day interrupter. Even if I could take five minutes in my writing space, I felt a sense of calm come over me. Ah!

Elsie Rae: What if you are in a small home and can't get your "own" space?

Joan: How about a tree in the backyard? The front porch steps? Look for a place where you will sort of blend in and people won't come to chat thinking you are open to visit. You may have to be creative. I've felt at times that it would be nice to put a quilt over my head--sort of like when I was a kid and we put a sheet over a card table to play tents in the woods.

Moderator: My own first office was a tiny closet that my desk barely fit it, but it worked! Joan, the question we all have for you is HOW do you organize your time with so many kids?

Joan: Sometimes you have to work at it a day at a time. What's ahead today? Can you see any pockets of time ahead? I used to find a carpool helpful in two ways: first, listening to the kids was a writer's treasure! Second, I spent so much time in line that I found I could write in my notebook, move up, sit, write, move up. A few lines at a time really adds up. I have a filing cabinet full of that kind of thing. I guess what I'm trying to say is that a writer has to be alert for the unexpected minutes she can use and be ready to use them.

Moderator: Can you talk a bit about setting boundaries with children? Many of us--me included--stayed home so we could be with our kids. So where's the balance between meeting their needs and carving out the writing time?

Joan: Sometimes a writer has to use those hours when the kids are asleep, even if they are not the writer's most creative time. I remember hearing Betsy Byars say that when her 4 children went out the door to school, she went to her desk, and she stayed there until they came home from school. For those whose kids are not yet in school, there are nursery programs at church, such as mother's day out, that meet for a few hours each week. Just a few hours a week that can be devoted to writing help the writer. And since the mother is "on" when the children are home, it feels like both are getting their time. As kids get older, they can participate more in the parent's writing and understand it better. Then it may be easier to write while they are actually in the house.

SaraJ: I am a stay at home mom on a block where everyone else works, so I get to babysit TONS of kids who seem to congregate in my yard. Any help for me there in finding time?

Joan: How are you at sitting in the midst of it all and writing in a notebook? I've done this in the midst of chaos and still managed to keep track of who was where, but that might not work for everyone. With so many kids and their friends, I've had to learn to be grateful for each short time of thinking and writing down what my thoughts were and I'll be honest and say I couldn't always read what I wrote in those minutes!

red2: Is there a "polite" way to convince family and friends that writing is "work" and get them to respect the time you need to commit to it?

Joan: I think it takes being determined that you ARE going to keep the schedule, that you DO respect your schedule, and you WILL keep it. This sounds so repetitious, but if you keep telling yourself that, and keep smiling, it should sink in soon that you are serious, and you are going to take a block of time that you have set aside.

SaraJ: What about people wanting you to do volunteer work at school or church? How can you help out but still set limits?

Joan: Start looking at yourself in the mirror and practice: I'd love to do that sometime, but right now, I am committed to all that I can handle. Thanks so much for thinking of me. As soon as I find I can help out, I'll give you a call.

Moderator: GREAT IDEA! What about setting boundaries with adult children? Babysitting grandchildren? What can you actually SAY or DO to deal with this and maintain good relationships?

Joan: You have your own calendar which you will have to check before you can commit to babysitting. If your children see that you have a schedule, too, just as they do, it will get easier. A drop off situation is very hard to change without being really determined. You may get a few huffy responses, but keep smiling and being there when you can be there. I'm not talking becoming a hermit, just having blocks of time for YOU, even if it were not writing. If you become a grandmother, it must be because you were a mother, so you've paid your dues for being on call. It took me a long time to get the hang of this, but if I did, so can you.

Is there anyone you can make a covenant with that you will ask for your own time (an hour a day maybe?) and stick to it? Then you have a friend that you can encourage and your friend can do the same for you. My critique group is wonderful about this. We encourage each other to write, even when it's only a few sentences. Sometimes we have to have time to float, and that's when reading is not only a pleasure, but it fuels the writing for later, too. Writers sometimes need rest time, and that's what reading can fuel. The "it" that needs to be fueled is that space inside you that sometimes seems empty because the writer is tired. Reading can rest and re-charge the batteries, too.

Granny Janny: When my kids were small I had a sitter come on Saturdays to take the kids and leave me time for myself to do whatever I wanted to do. It worked out fine. Of course 30 years ago, sitters cost a lot less.

Joan: You were wise. The young moms in our church have started a sitting arrangement whereby they take turns watching each other's kids. I think the hardest part for the writer is not getting the sitter but using the time she gets to write and not to run errands, straighten up the house, that sort of thing. It's really hard to sit down and write when you can't show that you are producing something others will value. Some manage this better than others. I still think it comes down to how much a person values her own dream. The voices of the world can be very strident. This is why those ads say, "You are not alone" or something like that. It is lonely to be a writer. If you have another writing friend, you have an ally. The nice thing about a constructive, producing critique group is that you not only have allies, but your writing is growing along with your confidence.

Tigger: What do you tell family members who don't take your writing seriously because "there are so few writers and so few make it." Some of my family members measure success by the amount of money involved.

Joan: By now you probably know that your chances of making millions writing are slim enough that you aren't writing for money. Your rewards are different. If you have that desire in your heart to write, then honor and respect it. What are your family members doing that is putting them in the situation they think YOU should be? Maybe they are really wishing they had your talent or your dream. It's sometimes difficult to see someone else working toward a dream when you don't have a dream at all.

Granny Janny: How do you balance a full time job and your writing? I find I only have time to write on the weekend, and only if I'm not too tired.

Joan: I've tried to make more and more of my "day" job be about writing, but I know what you mean about being tired. Sometimes it feels like I'm running with my feet stuck in bubblegum. Short breaks can help. If you can take a short nap and not be ruined for the day, whatever rests and refreshes you--try doing that in order to gain just a couple of hours of writing time. If you wrote for ten minutes a day each week, that's over an hour at the end of the week. If you don't write for ten minutes per day that adds up to nothing. Keep putting pen to paper, or as one conference speaker said, your fanny in the chair. In time, you make something appear on the page and when you reread it, you'll be proud of yourself. That builds confidence and you begin to see yourself as a writer who writes, no matter what.

Moderator: Did you ever feel guilty taking time from your family to write? If so, how did you deal with that guilt?

Joan: No, I've never felt guilty about taking time for my writing. I guess I wanted to write so badly that I wouldn't let guilt take my time. Now, I have felt guilty about taking time away from my fun loving toddlers to vacuum or some other awful household task. Maybe the guilt comes rushing in when you are wishing you could be doing something else!

Moderator: How can a writer set priorities?

Joan: Priorities are so specialized that each writer has to figure out her own. I have two plans that have helped me. When I first took a class in writing for children, Kersten Hamilton, the instructor, asked each of us to rank order 1-5 the five biggest blocks of time we spent during the day. For example one writing student might have said family, church, committees, writing, and housework. Next, we were asked to rank order the same five the way we wished they were. What if you wanted to move writing up a space or two? Then Kersten asked us what we were willing to sacrifice to make that change. If that same person wanted to put writing in front of committees, maybe she'd say she would choose three of the five committees she served on and drop the other two. This would be a gradual change, not a sudden earthquake kind of change. But the writer could see and feel the difference.

The other kind of priority has to do with a notebook one of my critique group members gave to each of us one year. On it she wrote "Dreams and Goals" and then she told us to write dreams on the left hand page and goals on the right. A dream is light and wonderful and we were told to dream big. Only in fairy tales do dreams come true without some effort on the part of the dreamer, however. That's where the goals come in. If the goals that are needed to move closer to realizing that dream are listed on the page, the writer can see herself, step by step, making progress toward the goal. I've used this a lot and really appreciate the thoughtfulness of Debbie Sanders who did that for us. See? I told you a critique group or a writing friend can give you that support that you might not find in your kitchen.

Moderator: I love that "rank order" idea! I'm going to try that. Joan, how can the busy-to-the-max writer plan and set goals?

Joan: I think sometimes you have to step back and ask just what is the most important thing and then what is the least important. Can you cross off the "leasts" in order to have more time for the "mosts?"

Moderator: After the big goals are set, how do you determine short-term goals and focus in on them with all the distractions of having a "real life"?

Joan: Writers brainstorm plots. What if you were the main character in your own story? How would you set up obstacles for your character and how would you have her overcome them? If you look at the day ahead and see that you could do just one short-term thing but it would be important to the big picture, would that make it even more important to get that one thing done? Sometimes just seeing that little glimmer of possibility can energize. I'll do just this one more thing and then I'll reward myself with . . . It's like that carrot that leads the animal (was it a horse?) forward. It you can just do one more thing, then you can. . . I do a lot of small rewards for small jobs when I have a schedule that seems impossible. Breaking it into small jobs is sometimes the only way I can get through a mountain. I know that looking at the big job can be overwhelming, so I try to see how many small parts make up a plateau and then go to the next level. This is one way to get through a 600 page book: think of it as one page and then another.

Moderator: What are realistic goals to set as (l) a brand new writer, (2) a writer with a few publishing credits, and later (3) when you're more published?

Joan: Well, let's break that into small parts! The brand new writer has a mountain of craft, marketing, networking, and names and faces that seem overwhelming. A book on how to write might be a first step. Finding out about SCBWI activities in the area would be another good step to take. Attend a one day conference or even a half day meeting where the new writer can make a few friends who can answer a few questions. Focus on one aspect of writing to learn about, like maybe plot. Find out what it is. Look for it in good books, but since we're talking about writing for children here, make sure it's children's books. Learn about each publishing house the same way. Read the recently published books from a particular house and let its style sink in. Become familiar gradually and thoroughly, while at the same time, work on craft.

What worked for me might not work for everyone. This is just how I had to do it. I tried looking at the hundreds of magazines, both adult and children's, and tried to write for all of them, or thought I had to try. Then I realized I was in a panic and decided to focus on children alone for awhile. Then out of the dozen magazines I selected, I narrowed my focus to one and kept submitting and submitting until, a year later, I sold a story to that magazine. By then, I was beginning to understand what it means to study the magazine and also the market.

Now, to the writer who has a few credits. She can benefit greatly from writers' conferences. SCBWI holds conferences around the world and nonmembers can go to most of them. A serious children's writer will quickly see and seize the benefits of membership, however. Of course, a new writer would also benefit from SCBWI, but one who is able to absorb vast amounts of information should be ready to leap forward.

I think the third category was the published writer, the one who is really on a career track. There are professional writers' organizations, such as the Authors' Guild, which focus on career strategies more than craft, and when a writer gets to this point, she really needs a solid source of information.

This is all a building process, and if you can compare it to starting in first grade and learning to read and then move into chapter books, and then novels, it is similar to learning to write. Nothing is wasted. A good foundation is something to be prized. Where can the writer go to get the best, most helpful information? Look at the writing how-to shelf in the library. That's a great place to start. Look up SCBWI on the web and follow the links to the regions and the links the regional web sites have set up. The wealth of information is amazing. It's an education right there with no travel time or parking space required. Take classes and hone your craft. Join SCBWI and go to conferences. Let the conference be your time away for YOU if you have trouble getting it any other way. For some writers, the conference may be the only writing time they have in a month or six months, but still, the writer is adding to her store of knowledge and building a network of contacts and writing friends who will be supportive and keep her going as well as growing.

Moderator: When you have the goals written down, the deadlines on your calendar, your desk organized--and yet you still can't seem to get going--then what?

Joan: Pen to paper is an important concept. Don't expect the world's greatest novel to fall from your pen when you put it on the page. Write a letter to your mother or yourself when you were a kid. Just write something. Keep your hand moving. Besides, if you want people to know you are writing, let them see you write! You don't have to read it to them until you want to. Sharing your writing is your gift to the reader. Look like a writer and before you know it, you are!

Moderator: How can a writer keep up his/her spirits when there is no proof of publishing, (that is, no byline) and no people lined up around the corner of the bookstore eager to get a glimpse of the world famous author?

Joan: I call these the gremlins. Those are the voices who ask you where they can read your work. If you are published in magazines, they ask, "No books?" If you have a paperback book on the shelves, they ask, "No hard covers?" If you have a couple of hard cover books in the store, they ask, "No Newbery?" If you've won a Newbery, the question is, "Only one?" There will always be people willing to belittle your accomplishments whether it is your first draft completed (Yes!) or an award they will claim they never heard of.

My writing friend Brenda Moore told me this when I interviewed her for an article on success: the writer should enjoy the work while she's writing, because that's the only time it belongs only to her. Once the work is published, it belongs to the reader. The reader brings herself to the work and it doesn't belong to the writer any more. So the journey is where the joy is for the writer. That means that instead of something to say to those who would belittle our dreams, we just need to keep the dream so firmly in focus that we don't need to answer those naysayers. Believe in the dream. Believe in yourself. You'd want those characters you create to do that, wouldn't you?

Moderator: Joan, you've been so active in SCBWI that you were honored as a "Member of the Year." Has this involvement helped you as a writer to "stay on task"? If so, how?

Joan: Oh, yes. Every day I am in contact with many, many Southern Breezers, regional advisors around the world, and many who share the same love of writing that I have. They are a constant inspiration to me to keep writing, keep going, keep taking on that next project. When one of us succeeds, we all cheer as if we succeeded, too. I think children's writers are a special group for that reason. We can delight in the success of others. Wouldn't it be nice if all our friends, family members, and neighbors could, too?

Moderator: Yes, absolutely! Joan, how can a writer use conferences and retreats most effectively?

Joan: Prepare ahead and follow-up. Read the work of the speakers. If an editor is speaking, find out what he has edited or what books he likes and read those books. That gives you something intelligent to ask or say if you get the chance! It also helps you to get more out of what the editor says in his/her talk. Follow up after the retreat or conference. We just had a wonderful retreat focused entirely on historical fiction and now all the participants are e-mailing revisions to each other and critiquing those. The group is growing and glowing, too. The effect of that retreat is going to last and last.

Moderator: How can a writer use critique groups most effectively?

Joan: Be sure you are growing in your craft and in your professionalism. If you go home mad or crying, this is probably not the group for you! That is, if that reaction is frequent. Sometimes it takes a little edginess to get out of the comfort zone. Visit a critique group for several meetings to be sure it is a good fit. Do you get and give strengths first and then talk about how the mss. could be stronger? That sounds like a healthy atmosphere for a growing writer!

Moderator: I'm sorry to have to interrupt now, but we're out of time. Thank you so much, Joan, for sharing your personal experiences and humor on this subject! It's a constant challenge to manage our time, but I know our viewers have come away tonight with a lot of new ideas!

Joan: I enjoyed being here, Kristi. Happy writing, everyone!

Moderator: Do come back in two weeks on August 2 when Dee Stuart will be discussing "Educational Writing: How to Get a Go-Ahead." Sometimes it can seem like a long uphill battle to get from a professional query to getting that "go-ahead" on a project from an editor. If you love to research and learn new things, educational writing (in its many forms) may be for you. Dee Stuart is a full-time writer from Texas who has published historical and mystery novels for adults and both fiction and nonfiction for children. Two of her educational books are to be released in October: MOTORCYCLES from Enslow and MISSION SABOTAGE from Perfection Learning. Do come back in two weeks to visit with Dee about educational writing. Until then, happy writing, everyone!

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