Rx for Writers

Transcripts

March 16, 2000

MODERATOR is Kristi Holl, author and web editor of the Institute's web site. Kristi has published 22 middle grade and teen novels, as well as l00 magazines articles and stories.

Eileen is Eileen Dunn Bertanzetti, author of three books and more than 80 articles and stories for adult and children's magazines and newspapers. She's written extensively for the Christian market, including the electronic market. Her publishers include Our Sunday Visitor, Primary Treasure, Alive! for Young Teens, Christian Living, Pauline Books and Media, and many others.

Names color coded in blue are viewers who asked questions.

Interviews begin promptly at 8 Eastern, 7 Central, 6 Mountain, and 5 Pacific.

MODERATOR: Good evening, everyone! I'm excited tonight to have with us my good friend Eileen Dunn Bertanzetti to speak about "Writing for the Religious Market." Eileen has published three books and more than 80 articles and stories for adult and children's magazines and newspapers, plus the electronic book market. Welcome, Eileen!

Eileen: Hi, everybody!

MODERATOR: First, Eileen, who influenced you the most to become a writer?

Eileen: My parents. They were avid readers and always bought me books. They encouraged me to spend lots of time at libraries.

MODERATOR: Who is your greatest supporter now?

Eileen: My husband Greg. I dedicated my second book to him.

MODERATOR: That's neat. However, we do all get weary sometimes. What recharges you when you're mentally and creatively weary?

Eileen: I have to put the two dogs into the car and drive somewhere, not too far away, but somewhere we can hike in the fresh air. That always gives me new perspective.

MODERATOR: Do writers have to be of a certain--or any--religion in order to write for religious markets?

Eileen: No. I am Catholic, but I've sold to Mennonites, Baptists, Assembly of God, Nondenominational, and many more.

MODERATOR: How do you handle writing for different denominations and keeping their requirements straight?

Eileen: The most important thing to do is to get each market's writers' guidelines. Each of those guidelines will tell you if the magazine has "taboos" like "don't write anything with infant baptism" or "we need stories with a message, but don't preach."

kellylee_k: I would like to know when you write Christian stories, does it always have to correspond to certain "rules of religion"? I want to suggest good morals without being preachy or pushy. How do you do that?

Eileen: Does it have to correspond to rules of religion? That depends on the market. For example, OUR LITTLE FRIEND is published by Seventh Day Adventists. Before I wrote a story for them, I looked up their religion in a big book in the reference section of our public library where translations of the Bible are kept. That book gave details about every religion, including theirs. I learned what they believe in and what they don't believe in. I kept that information in mind as I wrote stories. The first story I ever sold was to them.

AnnaJayne: What exactly constitutes religious writing? Do you mention God on every page, or just show families praying? Or is the Christian angle implied instead of shown?

Eileen: Religious writing does not have to have God or anything else "religious" in it. Today, parents are so concerned about what their children are watching on TV and learning about in school. They want clean wholesome reading that will encourage their children to live good lives. Editors know that and want to give clean, wholesome reading to children, and this does not have to have any religious words in it. When you study the writers' guidelines, they will tell you what the editors want. But you also need to study recently published copies of their magazine so that you can see what "tone" they want in what they publish.

Jack: Do the Christian magazines use theme lists?

Eileen: Many of them do, so it would pay you to send for theme lists along with writers' guidelines.

Lori: I'd like to write Christmas and Easter stories for religious magazines and I know they need some every year. How do you find a different angle to use?

Eileen: One way to do that is to read a lot of stories about many different topics. These should be recently published stories. They don't have to be about Christmas either, but just really good stories. See how the authors take an ordinary topic, like buying a Christmas tree, and give it a new twist. You'll know what I mean when you read that particular story.

RiverRat: Is it easier to get published in the religious markets? Do they pay as well?

Eileen: It is easier to get published in the religious markets. They do pay less, on the average, than secular markets. You need to want to write for religious markets because it's what you enjoy. Or, from a strictly monetary and career veiwpoint, you can write for religious markets simply to build up your credits.

Christianwriter: What age group do you like to write for? Is there a certain area in the Christian market where there is a great demand?

Eileen: I like to write for the middle-graders because the child in me can relate best to that age. Traditionally, that age group also needs the most reading material, so that would increase your chances of selling to them.

kpo: Since the payment is low, do you do other writing for better pay?

Eileen: Occasionally I will write for a secular children's book market, but not for the secular adult market. But children's books, in general, bring less money than adult books, regardless of whether or not the children's books aim at the secular or religious markets. You usually need to write for a reason other than money when you write for religious and children's publishers.

christine collier: Is the magazine Focus on the Family a good market to get published in?

Eileen: Oh, yes, but it is also difficult to get published by them.

AnneKelly: I think that the biggest challenge in writing for the religious market, in particular for children, would be to keep the interest of your reader without sounding "preachy". Do you agree?

Eileen: Yes, I agree. It's difficult at first to figure out how to get your "message" across without sounding like you're sermonizing, but I have confidence that you can achieve that goal. Keep reading recently published material. You WILL succeed.

kellylee_k: What is the difference between inspirational and religious writing?

Eileen: Religious writing would be writing that aims at following certain religious lines of thinking, whereas inspirational writing doesn't have to have any religious slant. This is a general definition I've given.

kellylee_k: Many stories I have read quote the Bible. Is this necessary?

Eileen: No, not unless the writers' guidelines state that it is. That brings something to my mind: each magazine may want a certain translation of the Bible used. You can find their preference in those all-important writers' guidelines.

Norene: Do you find that religious stories told in parable form (in picture books) to be effective?

Eileen: Yes, parable form can be effective but again, check recently published magazines to see if a particular publisher uses stories told in parable. Those types of stories may have been overdone recently in a certain market and so will be hard to sell.

kellylee_k: I like to focus on the tough questions my 11-year-old daughter asks me about God. Like "I prayed, Mommy, but my cat still didn't come back!" Is this a good idea?

Eileen: If you're going to write for the middle-grade audience, using ideas from your 11-year-old is a great idea. Sometimes this can even give you a humorous slant to your story, and editors love to get humor. Humor can help sell just about anything. Think about commercials on TV. Wouldn't you rather watch ones with goofy frogs than with someone sermonizing about their product? Readers are like that too, and your first reader will be your editor.

SaraJ: Could you talk a bit about article writing on topics like money or families (for religious markets)? Is there a big need for this?

Eileen: If you mean family and parenting markets, yes. There is always a need for those types of pieces. Parents want to know a new and innovative way to get their kids to--for instance--save money, or a way to get their family into discussions more easily and often. If you can share some of your own experiences in these areas that have worked for you, you just might make a sale.

SaraJ: I was thinking of articles for kids (middle grade and up). What about this?

Eileen: Again, yes, there is a need for these types of articles for kids. Be careful to avoid overused ways of delivering these topics. I mean for example: avoid telling the reader how to earn money setting up his own lemonade stand. Think of something that hasn't been done before, or that hasn't been done in at least a year.

Christianwriter: I am interested in writing Christian fiction for teens--but it seems that a lot of teen magazines look for nonfiction. Do you think fiction for teenagers is a limited market in magazines?

Eileen: The teen market needs for fiction are on the upswing, as is fiction in most religious genres and age groups. For example, not too many years ago, it was difficult to buy a Christian fiction novel. It was thought that if it was not true, that it just couldn't be offered under the umbrella "Christian." But now there are even Christian fiction book clubs.

christine collier: What are some of the easier Christian magazines to get published in?

Eileen: Many of my students have been published in BREAD FOR CHILDREN, so that seems to be a good market to try. You could also try OUR LITTLE FRIEND, the first market I sold to. Keep in mind that they want only true stories, as does their sister publication, PRIMARY TREASURE.

Blue Phantom: How do you feel about religious subjects being the theme of a science-fiction novel? Can science and religion be in the same book?

Eileen: Oh, yes. As I said earlier, Christian fiction is on the upswing, and that includes genres such as science-fiction.

kellylee_k: What magazines can you suggest that are not preachy for first-time writers of nonfiction?

Eileen: MY FRIEND is definitely looking for pieces that aren't preachy. I sold one of my first nonfiction pieces to them. That would be a good avenue for you to try too.

MODERATOR: I know you combined writing with raising a family, Eileen. How did you juggle caring for kids, your husband, your house, and your job?

Eileen: Of course it wasn't easy. I wrote my first novel wherever I could. I remember sitting in the mall main thoroughfare and keeping one eye on the three children and the other eye on the manuscript I was working on. You can write in the car while waiting to pick up the kids.

MODERATOR: Do you belong to a writer's group? Do you recommend critique groups for new writers?

Eileen: I communicate via the Net with a few close friends who are writers. They have been invaluable support for me. One of those told me once, when I was feeling down about rejections I'd received, "You know, Eileen, getting published isn't as much a matter of talent, as it is a matter of hard work." I thought, "Well, I'm not sure how much talent I have, but I sure do know how to work hard." I hope this helps you too.

Johanna: When writing Christian novels, can you write for a specific faith, or should they be general?

Eileen: That depends on the publisher. Heartsong, for example, a line of Christian fiction for adults, has a whole list of do's and don'ts to follow because they sell their books to many different people who belong to all kinds of Christian religions.

kellylee_k: How many rejections do you usually get before someone publishes you?

Eileen: That question made me smile. My own submission log book has about 350 submissions logged in, and out of them, I've received maybe 100 acceptances. And, believe it or not, that's average.

AnneKelly: How long have you been a published author?

Eileen: Since 1986. I published my first story while taking an Institute course.

MODERATOR: AND, I must brag, she was MY student!!! :)

kpo: I know that pay is not paramount for you, but for those who must earn part of his/her living writing, do you have any suggestions? The pay rate is the same now as it was thirty years ago!

Eileen: The best advice I can give you is to either write a whole lot and submit a whole lot in order to increase your income; or you can diversify and write for more lucrative secular markets at the same time you write for religious markets; OR don't quit your day job. I opted for the latter.

kellylee_k: OUCH! How do you not get discouraged by the percentage of sales?

Eileen: I don't think you can avoid discouragement at times, but you can control how long it lasts. I get picked up in spirit by my writing friends who have been through the same process of rejection. One of my friends, Veda, even though she has sold more than 23 books, still gets rejections, and the beautiful part is that she doesn't hide that fact from me.

kellylee_k: I'm nervous about sending my manuscript! Do you get this way?

Eileen: Oh, yes. Of course. You can't help it. Just be sure to keep this nervousness at a minimum and don't let it stop you from submitting. Believe in the gifts you have. Believe that children need to read what you write.

Blue Phantom: Some people have very special experiences, even sacred; should these remain unwritten due to the possibility of others not appreciating the experience?

Eileen: Possibly. Or you can try what I did. When I wrote stories for OUR LITTLE FRIEND, for example, I interviewed my children's friends for stories. I changed the names of the children, and even their gender in order to conceal their identity so that they weren't hurt by the stories. When you do this type of changing all you have to do is tell your editor in your cover letter that this is what you have done. He will appreciate your sensitivity.

Johanna: I once read, from a prominent Christian writer, that we shouldn't even try writing fiction until we've published nonfiction. Is that true?

Eileen: Well, perhaps that writer meant the following: The markets, including religious markets, generally need a lot more nonfiction than fiction. So, with that in mind, perhaps that prominent writer you mentioned meant that if you try to get your nonfiction published first, because it is in greater demand, then those publishing credits will speak highly of your talent when you try to sell your fiction.

JAMES55CLINTON: Is there a nonChristian market? Can a Christian write for it?

Eileen: Do you mean a religious market for another religion, such as Jewish?

JAMES55CLINTON: Jewish - Hindu - Muslim?

Eileen: Yes, there are markets for other "nonChristian" faiths. I'm not sure what the Baha'i faith is, but they publish a children's magazine called BRILLIANT STAR.

buffie: How do you go about finding the right market for your work?

Eileen: Usually it takes some trying out of different markets. For example I recently submitted a children's book to one publisher and I received a rejection. That rejection I consider a GOOD rejection because it guided me in the correct direction in which to go next with my writing. The rejection said that my piece best suited a library market. Hmmm. I then knew that the style of the book best suited that type of publisher, and so guess which markets I will submit it to next?

Christianwriter: Do you think it is easier to get published by a magazine once you have sold a piece to them once? Does it help once they get to "know" you?

Eileen: In theory, that's supposed to work that way, but in reality, the most common experience of writers is that selling multiple pieces to the same publisher has no guarantees.

kellylee_k: If you write for a local newsletter is that considered being published?

Eileen: That's a question I can't answer. I know I write articles for our Diocesan newspaper, and that counts.

Johanna: Are going to conferences important?

Eileen: Yes. Before you go, though, I would find information on how to make the most of a conference. You can find that information in how-to-write books, in CHILDREN'S WRITER published by The Institute, in Society of Children's Book Writers and Illustrators bulletins, and in other publications aimed at writers.

Christianwriter: Do they have writers conferences that directly focus on the Christian market? How common are they?

Eileen: Yes. They are becoming more "common." Sally E. Stuart publishes CHRISTIAN WRITERS' MARKET GUIDE each year. My local library carries it, and you can also order it from your local bookstore or the Net. It has information on conferences and contests.

MODERATOR: Where did you get the idea for the first book you sold?

Eileen: Good question. My elderly friend who had published two books on the same fellow found out I taught adults how to write for children's markets, and she told me I MUST write a children's book about him since none were still in print that she considered decent.

SaraJ: Who was it?

Eileen: Who is the fellow about whom I wrote? Padre Pio of Pietrelcina, the famous stigmatist whom Pope John Paul II beatified last May.

MODERATOR: Neat! How many books have you written? How many of those have you sold?

Eileen: You really want to know? Well, I've written about a dozen books, and so far sold three. I consider my earlier attempts "practice" for the really good stuff. If I had sold my first books, I wouldn't have gone in the direction I'm headed now, and that would be a sad state of affairs, as they say.

MODERATOR: You've had one electronic book published. Do you recommend I submit to online electronic publishers?

Eileen: Oh yes. Online publishers are hungry right now for new writers and they pay a larger royalty than print publishers. Hard Shell Word Factory who published my KATIE'S SONG gives 30% royalties while print publishers give from 9 to 12% to start.

MODERATOR: You get paid for online publishing? How does that work?

Eileen: Oh yes, of course. Don't let the publicity about Stephen King's latest electronic novel being offered for free by some bookstores fool you into thinking electronic publishers don't pay their writers. They're probably doing this latest Stephen King thing for publicity for electronic books. The industry is in its infancy, but recently Bill Gates got into the act and promised to help the electronic book industry grow. He has even started an annual contest for electronic books. The winner gets some huge amount like $10,000. I don't remember the exact amount.

MODERATOR: Is online publishing the same as self-publishing? There is a lot of confusion about this in the moderator box.

Eileen: I agree that there is a lot of confusion about that. Self-publishing does occur with a few online publishers, but not with most of them. At the risk of sounding annoying I'm going to mention "writers' guidelines" again. Get the guidelines of any online publishers that interest you. See what they pay. If they say there is an upfront charge to publish your book, drop them right away. If they say you will share costs with them at any time during the publication process, drop them.

Christianwriter: Are there many online Christian publishers, if any at all yet?

Eileen: Yes. More each day. For more information, you could order the following book from your local bookstore or from an online seller: ELECTRONIC PUBLISHING: THE DEFINITIVE GUIDE by K.S.Wiesner. You can also go to http://www.openbook.org on the Net for information. Also check out the Web site of the Association of Electronic Publishers at http://www.members.tripod.com/~BestBooksCom/AEP/aep.html

MODERATOR: Excellent advice! This answers about six questions in the moderator box!

Blue Phantom: Do you know anything about Instantlinks? They are an electronic publisher that has e-mailed me; I don't know if I should reply.

Eileen: No, I've never heard of them, but when I get messages from companies like that, I don't respond. Stick with the names that you'll find in Wiesner's book or at those web sites I just gave you.

Pegasus8032: If you've never had anything published, would you still recommend online publishing?

Eileen: Yes. Many of the online publishers are just getting started, so they welcome new writers.

AnneKelly: How did you get involved with/find out about the electronic book market?

Eileen: I found out about the electronic market through reading magazines aimed at writers like you and like me. Magazines like WRITER'S DIGEST, THE WRITER, and ROMANCE WRITER'S REPORT often list markets that are online publishers.

buffie: Have you heard of First Edition? It is under Evangelical Christian Publishers Association. Zondervan Publishers recommended that new or unpublished authors post their manuscripts there to get them noticed.

Eileen: I'm not sure I've heard of them, but they aren't the only company that screens writers before those writers submit material to publishers. Some publishers (and you can find out which ones in Sally Stuart's CHRISTIAN WRITER'S GUIDE) won't accept work from any writer who has not first been screened by certain companies like the one you mentioned.

Christianwriter: Do you volunteer to work in the children's departments in your church? Do you find that this helps give you a "vision" on how children view God, religion, etc.?

Eileen: I used to do a lot of volunteer work for my church's children's departments when my own children were young. (They're all married now.) But now, instead of working in our church's children's departments, I find out what kids are doing and thinking these days by doing presentations at Christian schools. These presentations not only help me to sell my two Padre Pio books, but they also give me invaluable information about today's kids.

christine collier: Eileen, I'm not Catholic but I saw a book about Padre Pio on the Catholic network the other night; was it yours?

Eileen: I don't know. You might have been watching EWTN, and unfortunately, I can't get that through our cable company.

AnneKelly: Does on-line publishing mean the writing is published on-line or do you just submit your work on-line instead of mailing out a package?

Eileen: You know, I sort of thought I'd get that question because of the way I answered the last question. I should have used the term "electronic-book publishers." And, each electronic book publisher has its own way it wants you to submit material. Some will specify "by e-mail or snail mail." Others will say, "Only by snail mail." Get those "writers' guidelines." You can download them off of the electronic-book publishers' web sites.

Christianwriter: Earlier you mentioned SOCIETY OF CHILDREN'S BOOK WRITERS AND ILLUSTRATORS. How often is that bulletin published?

Eileen: Every other month.

buffie: Do you think it would be good to go with one of the companies that screens writers in order to get a first Christian novel published?

Eileen: That depends on which publishers you want to aim your novel at. Again, if I were you, I'd check Sally Stuart's CHRISTIAN MARKET GUIDE to see which publishers want writers to go through those companies.

MODERATOR: To what types of magazines should a new writer submit manuscripts in order to increase the chance of selling to those markets?

Eileen: Excellent question. If you're speaking about Christian markets, go first for the ones that publish their magazine every week. For example POWER STATION publishes weekly, so be sure to send them something suitable. Another tip for increasing your chances of selling is to aim at a market that uses a high percentage of freelance material in each issue. This information you can find in The Institute's CHILDREN'S MAGAZINE MARKET. For example, PRIMARY TREASURE is 95% written by freelancers like yourself.

kellylee_k: What does a company do that screens writers? I've never heard of this before.

Eileen: What happens is that you send them a letter asking if you could submit a manuscript to them for their perusal. If they say yes, then you send them the manuscript. They read it a few times and give you written feedback on which markets it suits. I'm not sure, but some of them will even submit the manuscript to the right publishers for you. Sort of like what agents do for writers. You know that some book publishers won't take manuscripts from any writer who doesn't have an agent. But don't let that scare you because many many publishers don't require you to have an agent, and, believe it or not, some publishers in their writers' guidelines, specify that they will NOT accept anything submitted to them by an agent. What are the two magic words, children? "Writers' Guidelines."

kellylee_k: Does it cost anything to use one of the screening services?

Eileen: That I don't know because I've never dealt with one. If you get their addresses out of Sally Stuart's CHRISTIAN WRITER'S GUIDE write to them and ask for their brochure. It will tell you all you need to know.

AnneKelly: Do you yourself have an agent?

Eileen: No. I never had one. I always like to say, "God is my agent." Of course, agents aren't usually apt to take on an unpublished writer of children's books. It's that old story that drives you crazy: "You can't get published unless you get published." But don't let that old myth fool you. You CAN get published at ANY stage of your writing career. Just don't ever give up.

Blue Eyes: Eileen, how many years have you been writing?

Eileen: I've been writing "with the intention of getting published" since 1984. And that gives you an idea of my age: 52. Which reminds me to assure you that it's never too late to begin your writing career. Remember Laura Ingalls Wilder? She didn't start selling her books until middle age.

MODERATOR: At what point should a writer give up on her writing career dream and pursue another line of work?

Eileen: Never. Of course, I should qualify that statement: Use common sense. If your husband or wife becomes irate every time you sit down to write, postpone your writing a few months until he/she begins to understand your need to write. If you just had your sixth child and your body needs more rest until it recovers and that means you can't afford the energy necessary for writing, postpone writing for a while. But I'd say never give up.

MODERATOR: Eileen, should writers always have someone else read their work before they submit it?

Eileen: That's a sound idea. My husband gets "volunteered" for that job. For my second published Padre Pio book, poor Greg almost ran out of the house screaming when I kept him busy helping me check the footnotes in the book.

kellylee_k: Do you know anything about the Canadian Christian Market?

Eileen: Only what I've read about in The Institute's CHILDREN'S MAGAZINE MARKET and Sally Stuart's guide. Be aware of the fact that some Canadian markets, in their writers' guidelines, will say they accept material only from Canadian writers. So if you're not Canadian, don't waste your time and postage.

Christianwriter: How many hours a day on average do you write? I am finding that the discipline of writing on a regular basis is the hardest part right now.

Eileen: I agree. I aim at five hours a day, four days a week. That leaves me time for family, my Institute job, friends, and church. Oh and don't forget leisure time too.

JAMES55CLINTON: If I submit a story to a magazine, should I wait for a rejection before trying another?

Eileen: That depends on what "rights" the magazine buys. If you sell "first rights," that means, if the magazine accepts your piece, they get to publish it first, but after that you can submit it to other publishers. You will want to check each market's writers' guidelines for what rights they sell. If I were you, at first, I would avoid making simultaneous submissions. Give yourself a chance to feel out the various markets. If you do simultaneous submissions too soon in your writing career, it could cause you a lot of unnecessary stress as you wait to see which editors accept and/or reject the piece you've simultaneously submitted.

kellylee_k: What do you do when you get writer's block?

Eileen: Writer's block, first of all, is an overused term. The best advice I can give is the best advice I have received from other writers: Put your fanny in the chair. Pick up your pen, pencil, or mouse and write. Write anything. Write about your dog, your spouse, your first-grade teacher who gave you a complex about your braces. Write about anything. And, before you know, other ideas will pop into your head, and you'll be on a roll. Go for it!

Tim Loftus: I think it is honorable that you devote your writing efforts to your faith. Do you have a personal mission statement for your writing goals?

Eileen: Yes, that I will always write the truth when writing nonfiction, and that I will write with my reader in mind so that I can try--by God's grace--to write what will most help that reader. And I want to say that the "success" I experience is no credit to me. Everything good comes from above. Everything.

MODERATOR: What a wonderful note to end on. I'm sorry to interrupt here, but we're out of time already. Thank you so much, Eileen, for coming to share tonight! It's been delightful for me personally, and very helpful to our viewers.

Eileen: You're welcome.

MODERATOR: Do come back next Thursday night, March 23, 2000 for our next "Open Forum" with me, Kristi Holl. I've published over 100 magazine articles and stories, as well as 22 books for the juvenile market, and I will be here to chat and answer any questions you have on a variety of subjects. Bring your QUESTIONS and OPINIONS to this moderated open forum next week. And now, good-night, everybody!

Return to Transcripts

93 Long Ridge Road, West Redding, CT 06896 Phone: (203) 792-8600 (800) 243-9645 Fax: (203) 792-8406 E-Mail: WebEditor@institutechildrenslit.com

Home | Writing Course | Short Story  | Full Story | Aptitude Test 
 Send Me Info | Enroll | Our Instructors | Our Credentials | Sample Lesson
College Credits | Tax Deductibility | From Overseas | Writer's Bookstore 
Newsletter | Writing Contests | Write for Adults | Free Writer's News
 Rx for Writers | Chat Room | Open Forum | Writing Tips  | Scheduled Events | Transcripts
Writer's Retreat | Writer's Support  | Student  Center |  Privacy Policy | Web Editor | Comments

Copyright © The Institute, Inc., 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
No part of the electronic transmission to which this notice is appended may be reproduced or redistributed in any form or manner without the express written permission of The Institute, Inc.